I have recently been 
having a conversation with a charming gentleman on a post from February.
See it here: Get Ready We’re Being Set Up.
I invite anyone who would like to comment to please do so but be warned. I will strictly moderate comments. there will be no name calling, no personal attacks on this gentleman who has been kind enough to read my blog and comment. Tthere will no profanity.
Public figures are fair game unless you’re afraid that the boogieman in Washington is monitoring your internet use.
Please see the post with it’s link and here is our conversation:
By: despicable on February 21, 2009
at 5:45 am
Everything everywhere from the beginning of time to the present day has a beginning and an ending, nothing lasts forever. Change is the only constant on our planet and in the universe. This being a proven fact of all that exists, I am persuaded to ask this question. …Why attempt to prevent necessary change from taking place? …Is it because of unscientific dogmatic bias? It is unscientific bias to hold onto that which no longer has relevance and has been rendered by the passage of time no longer useful, and consequently out of step with existing circumstances, situations and conditions. That which is no longer a positive influence inside the surroundings of our existence should be replaced by that which is a positive influence, … and it will always come to pass when the only change possible to take the place of that what exists, … is the diametric opposite of what already exists.
The diametric opposite of an economy that is market oriented and not planned is an economy that is planned, … and designed to profit not individual capitalists of our planet, …but rather.. profit equally, all of the people of our planet, without discrimination or prejudice.
What makes this economic change possible and necessary is the change in our means of producing goods and services. The technological revolution on our planet has made it possible to satisfy all of the needs of everyone everywhere on our planet. No one no longer needs to not have what is needed to live well and survive well because of our scientific and technological advances.
Those that are concerned about our tanking individual unplanned capitalist economy, should give some thought to the opposite view of an economy that is social and planned so as to profit the mass of people in the world without discrimination or prejudice.
By: Rob on February 21, 2009
at 8:51 am
The simple fact is collectivism has never worked anywhere at anytime and will not work here.
One of many reasons is that someone or a class of someones will make themselves the “leaders” and live above everyone else taking far more than their share.
It always has lead to dictatorship in the past and is leading there again at this time.
By: despicable on August 31, 2009
at 8:24 pm
Everything on the planet and in the universe evolves. It is a cause and effect process that is an objective manifestation that is independent of subjective notions of what should and shouldn’t be.
Political and social change is not the result of secret conspiracies by large national and international organizations.
All change is something that occurs because at a particular point in time, due to objective circumstances, situations and conditions, it becomes imperative and necesary that a particular change takes place, a change that is the only possible thing that can happen, because all other options had been exausted.
The “Global Economy” and the “New World Order,” evolved, … and is something that was predictable and was not the result of a world wide secret conspiracy of international bankers and liberal politicians. It evolved because the capitalist system could evolve in no other way.
“Capitalism” has outgrown Nationalism” and the only possible direction that the system of capitalism can move toward so that it could continue to grow, … is toward the system of “Globalism!”
http://blogdespicable.blogspot.com/
By: Rob on September 1, 2009
at 1:58 pm
Thank you for comments.
By: despicable on September 1, 2009
at 3:15 pm
The political and provincial “RIGHT WING” are fearful of moving forward, away from their tribal beginnings and their established customs. What is on the other side of the mountain is met with suspician and fear that translates into angry hate! “People that are not of the same clan, religion, nation” etc. according to the immoral Right Wing “should be killed.”
It is either us or them according to the bigoted torture approving genocidal fascist loving ignorant separatists that are the political right in every nation on the planet.
Those that say that the Political Left is precisely the same as the Political Right are politically ignorant of politics and are most likely are ignorant of most everything that exists on the planet.
Most Fundamentalists of all orthodox religions appear to have tendencies that would prefer to retrogress backward into the time that existed in our ignorant past. They have always opposed scientific and techonological progress.
The “Progressive Political LEFT Wing” are the forward looking political wing that is the opposite of the reactionary fearful and hateful political rightwing!
And what about the Political “Centrists?” …These fence sitting non commital opportunists will compromise the guts out of every proposal so as to keep everything at a standstill so that we do not move backward into the ways of the past, or forward into the ways that will be our future.
When the “Political Center,” becomes no longer relevant to the existing changing circumstances, situations, and conditions, the followers of the centrist position will move into the ranks of those that want to move backward into our no longer relevant past, and into the ranks of those that want to move forward into our not yet known future.
Without a Political Center to compromise the differences of the Right Wing and the Left Wing these extreme wings of the political spectrum will clash!
The clash between the “Future: and the “Past.” will eventually be compromised by a new “Relevant Center.” A CENTER that will come into being and replace the “Old Center,” that is dumped into the trash can of the no longer relevant and exisiing past.
http://despicable.wordpress.com/
By: Rob on September 1, 2009
at 5:14 pm
Sir,
Thank you again for your comments.
I feel, however, the need to address some of them.
It is in fact the “LEFT WING” that is extremely political and I don’t know if provincial applies to tight or left dogmatic and pedantic and arrogant absolutely apply to the “LEFT”.
The comments about tribalism, religion, nation, clan and bigotry leading to the conclusion that those who are different should be killed first is simply not true and if it is it is the left that has been more genocidal than any other group.
For example: Stalin, Pol Pot, Hitler. Mao.
I may be ignorant but I am striving not to be thus allowing your comments on this blog and listening respectfully to what you have to say. I will not attack you personally.
I would agree with you that fundamentalists of all stripes including the fundamentalists such as Christoper Hitchens, Richard Dawkins, Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid and President Obama are very dangerous in their orthodoxy and rigid belief systems. I do not exempt the right from these same tendencies.
The “Progressive Political LEFT Wing” are anything but. They have been throwing out the same old tired ideas for as long as I know of and the fact is they never work in real life however good intentioned they are. this does not imply that some government programs do not work well but one only has to look at the mess in New Orleans to see how a city and state that has been run by the progressive left for decades was completely incapable of taking care of its citizens and the citizens were incapable of taking care of themselves. To try and foist this off on the Federal response is idiotic and ignorant. The fact is it is the state’s responsibility and the loopy mayor and governor waited until the disaster was completely out of hand before reacting.
I agree with you as well that we should not be looking to the past. hence I no longer consider myself to be a liberal in the terms in which is defined today. The left has nothing much of value to offer as we move into the future.
There is no center.
There are people who don’t care or are willfully ignorant.
There are people who reject fanaticism and extremism as they are the single greatest cause of the world’s problems today. I fall into that group.
I don’t want to kill anyone except those who want to harm me, my family, friends or my country. Thus I am happy for American armed forces to be killing Al Qaeda, Taliban and others who would kill us and have. It has nothing to do with being different except from the fanatics on the other side. No talking will assuage these extremists.
I have enjoyed reading your comments and hope you keep up the agitation. It is good for America.
Mr. Despicable;
Who is it you quote with this statement as you have used quotation marks?
“The political and provincial “RIGHT WING” are fearful of moving forward, away from their tribal beginnings and their established customs. What is on the other side of the mountain is met with suspicion and fear that translates into angry hate! People that are not of the same clan, religion, nation” etc. according to the immoral Right Wing “should be killed.”
There are several comments I would like to make regarding a number of your remarks. First, I would like to address your quoted remarks. Are those words you have heard repeated some where and you like to repeat it a lot, are they your words that you like to repeat often to others about those on the right, or are they the words of some great orator without manners and common sense? With any answer you might offer, it still seems as though these are words you likely believe as I read the entirety of your remarks. Often, those who think more fiscally conservative or right wingers are often psychologically analyzed by those with superior knowledge like yourself, without actually sitting down and talking to them. Of course I don’t know if you even allow yourself to be around such kind of (ughh) people like that. Of course you have probably guessed that like Rob, I am a conservative and all those words you used (quite hatefully I might add),do not describe me or any other conservative I know. I do know many. I do not consider myself hateful, fearful, stupid, full of rage, especially to the point of killing, nor am I afraid of others not in my own clan, here or across the world; quite the opposite. In fact, your remarks toward those of us who think differently than you sounded more of what you described about us. Shall I copy and paste?
“reactionary fearful and hateful political right-wing!…It is either us or them according to the bigoted torture approving genocidal fascist loving ignorant separatists that are the political right in every nation on the planet.” Those that say that the Political Left is precisely the same as the Political Right are politically ignorant of politics and are most likely are ignorant of most everything that exists on the planet.”
Hmmm, I don’t think I hear very many right wingers talk as ugly as that. In fact, often I have wondered why is it that people who are on the left so angry and radical about their every thought and word? Why is it that liberals who believe in a cause, can march up and down in the streets all day long, turning over cars, bashing in windows, saying ugly things, and carrying hateful signs, is considered a wonderful “grassroots movement”. Now, don’t get me wrong, I am completely excited that we are able to have free speech without fear of government reprisals. Apparently for those who like to march & express their thoughts and ideology (as long as it is liberal or radical) it is completely the American thing to do. However, those who march with a different forum, though marching united in all political parties, are considered un-American and are not taken seriously. We have an “astroturf” movement and considered loons because we believe in The Constitution. At this point, all I have experienced is that those on the left have NO tolerance for differing opinion or diversity!
And yes, I do agree with you that change is inevitable, but I disagree with you about only one thing that remains unchanged. I believe you said that “change is the only constant on our planet”. Well, I also believe that history does not change. We might like to change it, none-the-less, we cannot erase the evils or goods of history, so before you think that all change is good, take a look back and see if you still believe that not repeating some very serious socialist, fascist, and communist past history is not relative even for today. Those who have failed to failed to see the relevance of history “are doomed to repeat it”!
By: Laura Orr on September 2, 2009
at 6:02 pm
Laura, the left is willing to hit below the belt and after the bell. We righties want to be nice.
Rob, did there not used to be a center?? We are really polarizing as a country.
By: willohroots on September 2, 2009
at 9:52 pm
Will,
I actually believe that the center is where most of reside in spite of what the vitriolic press and commentators would have us believe.
the center is comprised of people who care about the country, each other, doing what is right and trying to make the world a better place for all of us.
We may not all agree on the best way to accomplish all of that but I think almost all of us, at least the great majority, want the same things.
There is a fringe on the right and the left that are so loud that they make everyone think that they are the norm and speaking for all of us.
They don’t speak for me and I don’t really think they speak for most decent and thoughtful people.
I detest the hateful speech that passes for commentary from both far fringes of the political spectrum.
What has happened to honest discourse, manners and courtesy?
Well, I can be nice and hold to my beliefs at the same time or at least try very hard to be.
My friend, Laura mentioned something to the effect that we can’t sit on the sidelines. I agree with that.
However, we can also let our better natures rule and if you are Christian you know where that ability and power comes from.
If you are not then be nice anyway.
After 8 years of the left brutalizing President Bush and 8 years before that of the commentators brutalizing President Clinton I am just sick of the lack of civility.
I think that the left is very hypocritical in that they characterize conservatives as hateful when they are so very hateful themselves. But of course they are smarter than the rest of us.
Sorry, I digress.
As you have heard me say in other places Jesus’ earthly ministry can be summed up pretty much by (I’m paraphrasing of course) “Love God and be nice to each other”.
My next post is going to quote Warren Zevon’s song,”Don’t Let Us Get Sick” which I think is germane to this discussion.
By: Rob on September 2, 2009
at 10:19 pm
Willohroots:
Yes, those of us who are considered conservative have likely been admonished at home for treating people badly and saying ugly things. I know I was. Unfortunately it has also given me a sit by the side lines mentality.
By: Laura Orr on September 2, 2009
at 11:43 pm
Oddly enough, after reading the posts from February, I found myself thinking about science fiction. There is a place where I agree with Despicable, and that is that it appears as though events, globally, are winding up towards some type of explosion, but what that explosion will/could be I cannot say.
So, why do I find myself thinking about science fiction? Well, since the first beginnings of modern globalism, in the 1970′s, science fiction writers have been looking at this era in the Earth’s history and positing some type of serious change. However, they are not sure of where the change is headed.
Isaac Asimov even pre-dated the those writers and in the 1950′s foresaw a world run somewhat on the model of Sparta (Starship Stormtroopers). In the 1980′s Jerry Pournelle saw a world run by an alliance that was falling apart and also saw a war coming upon earth and a resulting semi-Sparta like empire (Falkenberg’s Legions).
Robert Heinlein in the 1980′s saw a world in which the multinational corporations behaved a lot like sovereign countries, right alongside sovereign countries because as the world globalized they had accumulated impressive political and real power. The world pictured was a wild mess (Friday).
The science fiction writers have been seeing a coming global social explosion for several decades now, even before the term globalization became widespread. Their imaginative minds, that construct worlds and consequences all the time, have been able to follow the threads of history towards a coming explosion.
No, I am not going towards an apocalypse scenario nor for the Second Coming of Christ (although one never knows). However, what is true is that a globalized free market presents some serious problems towards nations of whatever political stripe–no not challenges, outright problems!
You see, the large international companies are now able to fairly freely bypass “local” regulations, to manipulate markets, and to behave in a way that is only responsible to themselves, meaning to their corporate culture and top leadership.
But, historically, capitalism–meaning free market–began in the 1600′s with Dutch merchants who wanted the government to let them run their business with little interference. They successfully argued to the King that the freedom he would give them, from excessive control and excessive taxation, would result in a much more profitable middle class who would bring more to the King in taxes than the businesses could by themselves (sound familiar?).
But, those businessmen were functioning within the context of country and culture. They were loyal Dutchmen not global entrepeneurs without loyalty and without some form of legal and cultural controls. A capitalism that functions within a national context–even if supposedly free market–actually has some controls built into it. That is why the sweatshops of Charles Dickens’ time, the Scrooges were able to be stopped eventually, and workers were able to be given some protections.
The increasing problem is that as globalization has become stronger and as multinationals have taken advantage of the possibilities, we now have lost those boundaries of context that the early capitalists have. Now protect workers in one place and the multinational quickly moves the jobs somewhere else. Thus any type of adequate protection against the depradations of “robber barons” and “Scrooges” become increasingly hard to implement.
Moreoever, as the collapse at the end of President Bush’s term shows, there is an increasing lack of loyalty toward either people or nation, with a concommitant inability to exercise self-control. In fact, with a very few exceptions, the top capitalist all were immune from the severe worldwide economic downturn.
Thus capitalism is no longer the capitalism that was defended by Adam Smith. And, I fear, the science fiction writers are correct. This will lead to one big social explosion.
By: Fr. Ernesto on September 3, 2009
at 2:45 pm
As expected, Fr Obregon has an interesting take. Thanks for taking it easy on me.
By: Rob on September 3, 2009
at 5:57 pm
Statements made by dispicable that are just out-right wrong.
“Everything everywhere from the beginning of time to the present day has a beginning and an ending, nothing lasts forever.” This forgets God, who is the beginning and the end.
“Everything on the planet and in the universe evolves.” No, things, develop, nothing evolves, God controls all.
“Most Fundamentalists of all orthodox religions appear to have tendencies that would prefer to retrogress backward into the time that existed in our ignorant past. They have always opposed scientific and techonological progress.”
OUTRIGHT PROPAGANDA, Totally untrue. To lump all religions together is a modern phenomena that shows great ignorance of religions in general. Christianity has been the very birth place of Science. Newton, Galileo, and so many others could be called Fundamental believers. Fundamental Christian does not mean a snake handling, KJO , buffoon.
The term can be used to mean someone who believes in the fundamentals of the faith, as do I.
Playing into these falsehoods shows a level of indoctrination to the left that disallows free thinking and makes one a echo of a lost culture, a culture that feels superior as they sink into Godless anarchy.
Despicable, stop repeating party platitudes, and think out your positions with an open mind, do your own thought work, you conclusions will change.
The “Progressive Political LEFT Wing” are the forward looking political wing that is the opposite of the reactionary fearful and hateful political rightwing!” No one hates more than the left. It is evident in their communications and lack of meaning full activities to fight against what they say they do not like. Where is the left wing version of ,Salvation Army, SBC disaster relief, Mission of Healing, etc. etc., they talk and talk while we fundamentals and right wingers act! They can not organize themselves into a usable group , rhetoric is their home, not action. I am sure Satan finds them “useful idiots”, a term out communist enemies used to rightly describe them until the fall of
the Evil Empire.
By: willohroots on September 7, 2009
at 7:22 am
Fr. Ernesto’s use of the Dutch as examples of non global capitalism is mind bending, especially when in NY city we are celebrating New Amsterdam week! the Dutch East India Company , in 1602, comes to mind. It was a privately held company. [How capitalistic] The Dutch started in the fish business and went on to sell Italian marble to the French! After they threw off the yoke of Spain, with I must add mostly foreign troops that they purchased with money from successful international capitalism, they went on to explore the world and have a banking system that rivaled that of Florence, Selling Polish grain in the “little ice age, brought a fortune used to expand trade routes to India and China for pepper and cloves.
This free trade capitalism brought art patronage, the first of such beside the Church, that allowed freedom of subject, hence Rembrandt et all.
This also lead to religious freedom, by the way only in capitalistic societies do we see such freedom, bringing an influx of Jews from Spain and my Calvinist ancestors from England, who would go on to land on Plymouth Rock. My ancestors were aboard that vessel, all made possible by Free Dutch Trade in an open market!
I read the same science fiction that was read by Fr. Ernesto , but it seems i read a very different history book. My conclusions will not be based on fiction, but on an accurate history of capitalism, the system of democracy, art, science and free will. Think about it as you sit before the computer, a gift of capitalism.
By: willohroots on September 7, 2009
at 7:54 am
Sometimes, as today, I find myself completely in a mindset that there is not use in fighting anymore against those who intend to turn this country into a socialist state. There are too many people with too much power in too many important positions that know too many important other people. The middle class is screwed (as always) with the new health care mentality. Do they not look at other countries and see the failure? Honest to God, I KNOW I am smarter than those like Barney Frank, Nancy Pelosi, and the other idiots that hang together. And then there was this latest idiot republican (Lindsay Graham) that shows no resemblance of conservativsim of the true Republican party what so ever talking about being more like the democrats…oh good grief! When will a real Republican stand up and speak up without fear? So far, my only vote is for Sen. Demint from SC. and Ron Paul from the Dallas area.
Ever since I read “The 5000 Year Leap, the Miracle That Changed the World”, my views and life have changed about how I view a true patriot. When I realized what had to be accomplished to get the Constitution written and what had to be suffered to make this a free nation, I become enraged at those like Obama who will not even take a break from dancing, golf, and making spin for the Olympics to talk with his hand picked general and defense minister to send enough manpower and equipment to support our troops who are already in harms way in Afghanisttan. Today alone 8 were killed in Iraq. If my son had not already passed and was in Afghanistan, I would be marching in front of the White House to make my feelings know. Can you imagine the fear of those parents, wives, sons, and daughters are going through. We look at our Congress and they are just like teenagers who always have their hands out constantly for more, more, more money, and will spend every dime and then some that is given to them. Something has to change, and quite frankly, I see no man nor woman who has the guts to do the right thing. I’m scared to death. The only person in the news that gives me hope is Glenn Beck (sorry Rob) because I do think his dreams are about the country and not his ratings. He has been down and out and knows how fast it can come and go and I believe he speaks in truth. I am reading all I can get my hands on and admittedly, I have learned alot but my “sit by the side mentality” was “ignorance is bliss” and am truly considering going back to that so that I can stop living in fear. I am frankly concerned that this time the American people, especially those with the entitlement mentality will ruin this country and that our best years are now behind us!
Laura Orr
By: Laura Orr on October 26, 2009
at 5:05 pm
Laura,
I understand that sometimes it feels hopeless.
This morning I was watching the news and Glenn Beck was a guest.
Even he agrees with what I have asserted many times that the American people, the regular schmo as he put it, will take this country back.
We have had dangerous demagogues before.
Franklin Roosevelt comes to mind.
He was essentially a king but America did not fail we flourished even though he started us down the road to socialism and made the government more powerful than the founders ever intended.
I guess what I’m saying is don’t lose hope.
We will overcome.
By: Rob on October 27, 2009
at 5:47 am